KAMN Show #10: Ladyhawke
Welcome to Show #10!
This week, we discuss the 1985 fantasy Ladyhawke. Is it a cult classic, or is it something else entirely?
The Ninjas spark up a lively talk about the story, the attention to detail in the locations, and perhaps that not enough attention was given to the soundtrack.
Movies and music mentioned:
Promos and Links:
Promo: ChuckChat Technorama
Promo: 7th Son: Book One – Descent (JCHutchins.net link)
Link: RevUp Review Podcast
Hello,
I always loved this movie, but I haven’t seen it in years. I am suprised by some of David’s comments against the film. The things he mentions – the movie being about ‘the other guy’, the love story between the couple we never see together, and so forth – I find a lot of these to be the strengths of the film. It is so not typical of what Hollywood does these days. And the restraint of the film is what makes it stand out to me. Also, no one talks to the camera better than Matthew Broderick. He is the cinema king of breaking down the fourth wall.
You guys just don’t know good music when ya hear it.
Slightly more seriously it has been far to vogue of late to be down on 80’s synth music. Yet there is a lot of solid musical work from that decade, amongst which the works of Alan Parsons and co. are oft overlooked despite being excellent music. Ah well, times and tastes change I guess.
Guess I must be one of the few who bought the soundtrack but not the movie…
I’m not down on 80s synthpop music… I’m proud of my Miami Vice collection, and I’m so happy that the series finally started showing up on DVD last year. I also love the stuff Michael Mann did in the movies Manhunter and Band of the Hand… can’t get too much more loaded 80s rock and synth than Michael Mann!
It just didn’t fit the movie, and I don’t have a problem saying that. Just wait till we jump all over Toto for doing the Dune soundtrack!
And have you checked out how much that Ladyhawke soundtrack is going for on Amazon and eBay?
The music never really worked for me in this film, yet I still like it. Good ‘cast guys
This is a movie I’ve always liked. I never really paid much attention to the music, though. Sometimes you realize the music doesn’t work and just tune it out so you can concentrate on the movie.
BTW, what was up with Joe? I could barely hear him and when I would turn it up so I could hear his comments, Summer or David would come on and blow out my speakers because I had to have it so loud to hear Joe. Just wondering.
We’re working on getting the sound evened out. Joe’s setup is too close to his kitchen, so he’s thinking about getting a better microphone.
And I can’t believe you guys aren’t screaming about the singing attempt at the end of the show
I enjoyed the movie quite a bit. What I enjoyed most was the unspoken details of the movie. In the beginning, he shows her clothes in his helmet and strokes them across his face and at the end he wears her favor on his arm.
I kept humming “our love’s in jeopardyâ€? when the 80’s pop music segments appeared.
Though I did wonder how both managed to keep what they did keep during the years with all the changes.
The music was one of my favourite parts of this movie. And for me it was a perfect fit. It had an energy to it that evoked the running of a wolf or rider on horse back running swiftly across the high plains and also the feeling of the hawk soaring through the winds over the high plains.
And for GODS SAKE David, why dont you just go watch an Arnie or Sly Stallone movie?! Every complaint you have about this movie is basically because it’s not following the all flash and no substance formulae of Hollywood. Im appalled to here this tripe coming from a scifi and fantasy fan.
Great show as always guys. I don’t have much to say but was wondering if you guys know that Joe is almost impossible to hear when in a car and nearly while just listening at my cube. If I jack the volume up Summer and Dave give me an earache.
Sorry I just wanted to mention I can’t hear Joe.
Keep it up, this is becoming better than Slice of Scifi.
Me again I did want to mention another movie that doesn’t follow the theme of the movie by including music of the time.
What do you think of A Knights Tale?
Sorry, last time. Just so you know not being able to hear Joe is in about 90% of your podcasts. Just wanted to make sure you knew that so he can buy another mic.
oh and did the French ever control the lands in modern-day Italy depicted in the movie?
Perhaps that would explain the Italian names of the locals and the french names of the protagonists?
As for the sha na na at the end of the show, I thought it was funny. And thought I haven’t ever watched American Idol, I think you guys would have been fan favorites for less than flattering reasons.
Fred, I’m just surprised that it took this long for someone to comment on our attempt at singing
Have you any idea how hard it is to try to sing while you’re trying so hard not to laugh?
I agree, you need to bump Joe up a bit. He sounded a bit nasal. However, what I liked was the diversity of POV (er, point of view) on the film.
Having been a Ladyhawke fan for many years, the subject of why Isaboe is such a “catch” is implicit in that she still stays with Navarre, even though she must suffer the humilation of being transformed into an animal for half of her life.
All she has to do is submit to the Bishop, and she can enjoy a “normal” life again. But her love for Navarre is such that even to never see her home, never see even Navarre again, is worth resisting evil.
This underlying trust in another is the hidden thread in the film. “Trust in the one you love and all will be resolved in the end.” Ah, well for Romeo and Juliet, not a good ending. But for Isaboe and Navarre, great.
Mouse is the commentator. He assumes the narrator role. And yes, MB is the best when it comes to that role. Only he could pull off, “Lord, if you are listening…”
It’s reviews like this that make me rethink why I liked/disliked the movie/tvshow/book. Thanks again!
KfK
Gary Zero, I’m a big fan of A Knight’s Tale. How can I forget when I first fell for Alan Tudyk? Damn, that’s one funny man.
Tony, the music for Ladyhawke so did not have an energy to it. Just stop.
I promise, the next show you will hear me. You’ll probably also hear all the ambient noise in my apartment, but you’ll hear me.
Yeah, I also thought A Knight’s Tale was an amusing movie. Not great, but it didn’t suck. I also like Paul Bettany and James Purefoy.
It took me about 4 episodes of Firefly to realize where I’d seen Alan Tudyk before, too.
To clarify some of the confusion about the location–and trust me, Italian history is very confusing–I’ll summarize some of what I learned here. I hope it isn’t too boring or incorrect.
After the fall of the Roman Empire, Italy disintegrated into a mish-mash of city states. There was already a sizable Lombard population in Southern Italy before the Normans consolidated control of the area in the 1200s. France then controlled this area for centuries afterward.
Around 1254, the town of Aquila was founded. Aside from Naples, this became one of the principal cities of the region.
In the 1500s Spain took over. Control then passed to Austria (1700s) then France again (Napoleon in 1800s) before Italy was essentially unified around 1860.
So, at the time of the story, it makes sense that the nobility was French, while the population was Italian. Also note that there are many similarities between Italian and Spanish male names.
I haven’t finished listening to the podcast, so sorry if you’ve already noted this… but, I’ve found a reference indicating that the story is based on some French legend. I don’t have any details on that, but I will look into it.
I’m not finished listening either, but felt compelled to comment. I’m almost always in agreement with Dave on his book reviews, but I think he’s missing something with Ladyhawke, which is one of my favorite movies.
First, on the ‘Brokeback’ comment, Mouse was totally taken with the Lady…
Second, and something I haven’t heard you talk about yet…is what the couple’s true relationship is like. After all, Mouse does a fair bit of matchmaking/Cyrano-ing.
Third, I figured no one stopped him from killing the Bishop because the Bishop was a despot and they were glad someone was taking him out.
FWIW, the music didn’t bother me. I just tuned it out, I guess.
Ok Joe, now you’re making me watch the movie and note down timestamps for all the places where the music has energy. WATCH OUT buddy!
Damn I was hoping to respond before the next show, we from the deep south are just too slow for you fast first worlders…
Ok for me every movie or book (creative work) has a context in which it is created.
Bashing LadyHawke for its 80’s context is like slagging off Medieval monks (and their illuminated texts) for not writing simply. I think its an unfair slag.
I feel that movie theses days are far more slick and playing to the common denominator (or 13 year schoolgirl mentality according to Mike (Dragon Page)
So back in the 80’s possibly those involved in the film could bring out their own takes on the production.
This is a long way around to saying that I think someone in the creative process in the film was a Medieval History Major and the film thus has a strong “courtly love” motif.
Love in the Medieval age was supposedly pure, detached from base lust, the knight off on a quest for his love an unattainable princess on the tower. A handkerchief used to consummate the love, a blown kiss the high of its noble passion.
So the fact that we do not see the relationship before the curse, or the fact that the female role does not speak or come across with her own personality, or that it ends with them embracing this all fits with the “courtly love” theme.
So I think you just are not getting it?
Chameleon
Chameleon,
The only 80s styling of the movie I hated was the music. I liked the movie back then, and still do.
You also might have missed one key ingredient in your theory: the general storyline of the “courtly love” tale actually highlights the plight of either one or both of the lovers before they meet, so their love (and sometimes redemption) can be seen as a triumph over the forces allied to either keep them from finding their strength or keep them apart.
So Dave’s gripe about not seeing their life beforehand has merit, because the story breaks the typical “courtly love” myth. He didn’t get why they broke from that pattern. I don’t either, but that part didn’t bug me as much as it bugged him.
As for me and the romantic myth of medieval courtly love, I believe it to be just that… a myth. Human behavior and written history tells us life in reality was different, which is why we still cling to the myths.
Plus, I can’t see Richard Donner letting someone add themes to his movie, if they weren’t already there in the script and he thought they might work. Then again, he also thought that music styling would work…
I think Pete may have had it right… Mouse fell into the spell around the cursed lovers and decided to play Cyrano to keep their hopes up right when things seemed darkest.
Wow… long response. Thanks, Chameleon for bringing out the geek ramble in me
I thoroughly enjoyed it. I replied to your email also.